NEXT Glacier

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Kesterer
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NEXT Glacier

Postby Kesterer » Sat Jul 04, 2015 8:49 am

NEXT glacier out of HB seems like it might have got a bigger boost than any other deck from Marcus Batty, so I thought it might be nice to have a thread about it. I've been playing it all of regionals and nationals season, and frankly was about to give up on it, but now I'm reconsidering.

Here's my current deck - http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklist/2321 ... 1-5-batty- - definitely could use refinement, as it was tweaked first to include Power Shutdown, then Batty and it hasn't settled yet.

NEXT Glacier has been posting good results in Poland apparently, and the featured deck on NRDB this week is actually one of those (http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklist/2291 ... regionals-). That one looks very similar to my regionals/nats decks, which didn't do especially well, hence how my current version looks quite different.

So why do you want to play this deck? The answer is that it's super-flexible: you have cheap hard ETR ice to rush with if you want to, and once enough NEXT is up, your servers are taxing enough late-game to play a good glacier game.

However, it has a lot of weaknesses, and Parasite is easily the biggest. NEXT Silver is a great piece of ice when it stays up, but dies to Parasite hard, and when it does that weakens your Bronzes too, meaning they never get out of Yog range. So your matchup against anarch is super-bad.
The second problem is that NEXT Gold just isn't a very good piece of ice; it's going to hit only in a very small proportion of your games, and given that, paying 8 for two STR4 sentry subroutines is horrible.
Finally, my experience against PPVP Kate was that you could do a good job out of taxing her out of either your scoring remote or your R&D, but not both, so she'll just take the points out of the other one - though that may have been my deck and play rather than a problem for the archetype. Certainly getting rid of Eli 1.0 (who is both porous and vulnerable to Atman4, which often comes out for NEXT Gold) has helped.

Batty is going to solve the second problem pretty well - so well that running any face-down in a remote becomes super-dangerous for the runner. Even if you only have one other NEXT up apart from Gold, a psi to trash 2 programs (then probably two more) is ridiculous.
The other two problems still remain, however, so we'll see if Batty just ends up making it a high-variance matchup based on whether he fires or not.

Enough waffling from me; I'd really like to hear others' experiences with playing this. Any insights to offer? Any bits of tech I've totally overlooked?
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby Chimpster » Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:53 am

With a blacklist, agg sec, wormhole and batty, it would make sense to me to include some program trashing ice other than next gold as well. Maybe a grim or two?
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby pruneface » Sat Jul 04, 2015 10:56 am

This might be utter blasphemy but I think the weak link in the NEXT suite is NEXT silver (because, parasite). Against anarch you don't really mind if they parasite bronze so much because they're often running yog anyway and it only cost you 2 cr to rez; if they have yog out they might just leave you alone. I have not been running nexts at all lately. Now I am tempted to run just bronze, gold, and Mother G to set up the next gold + batty suckerpunch.

I think corp shooter can be useful if you're playing against a lot of mimic + sucker.
The onesie was a legitimate tactical decision.
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby MasterAir » Sun Jul 05, 2015 7:42 am

I think against Kate forcing a parasite on silver costs her more than it seems. It's not as bad a trade as it initially seems. You're right about anarchs loving the next matchup though. I think your other ice needs to be anarch hate. Which probably means Eli, architect and lotus field.

I might be wrong but batty + gold for the game is going to show up pretty infrequently. It's worth a look.

Is quicksand worth considering? Just overload their must parasite targets.
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby Kesterer » Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:15 am

Chimpster, it's a good call on Grim and I was wondering about that myself. I still haven't figured out whether 2 floating inf wants to go on Blacklist, to force remote runs and occasionally lock out runners, or Crisium Grid, which is great centrals protection for a deck that often loses from R&D. My current 1 of each is definitely wrong, but I'm not sure which side of the fence to fall off onto, and once I decide that I think it affects ice distribution a bit, as you say. Batty might push it the way of Blacklist, just because he's silly.

Seb, I tried to make Troubleshooter work for ages and it wasn't worth the slot. The number of conditions that need to apply for it to work are just too many: you need the money advantage, you need to be able to spend that money without otherwise crippling your game, and the runner has to not have access to Sharpshooter or David. It's easy to trash from centrals too. I think Batty and Cyberdex Virus Suite are much better for the role of making NEXT Gold stick: the former just needs you to win a psi game, and the latter lets you nail Anarchs occasionally by wiping suckers mid-run (plus it can be useful in other situations, which helps justify the deckslot).

MasterAir, good shout on Quicksand: I hadn't rated it much as I don't think it usually gets up high enough to justify it over Wall of Static - but WoS's only role against Kate is to tax Lady tokens, so Quicksand would do the same job there. Anarch and Crim tend to run centrals more often, so Quicksand's ability is more relevant, and you're right that it would push Anarch's Parasite capacity a bit more. It's worth testing, at least.

Anyone have good input on econ? I was on 3 Adonis 3 Eve, but have stolen the idea of switching the Eves for Melange from Brendan, and have been happy with it. You don't tax the runner so much, but you get rich quicker and that lets you protect centrals quicker, which helps avoid the lucky early accesses that can lose the game for glacier decks. I do miss Eve trashing making the runner super poor though.
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby MasterAir » Sun Jul 05, 2015 1:29 pm

I think the ice in this deck is maybe not heavy enough to support melange. There seems to be a disconnect between your ice and your long term plan. I can't support no elis. Eli remains one of the best ice in the game.
Oh that, don't worry about that, it's my negotiating tank.
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby Popeye09 » Tue Jul 07, 2015 2:30 pm

Is Grim better than Sagittarius?

Alright, Grim is less susceptible to Mimic (and Atman at strength 4) and is cheaper than Sagittarius, although it does give away a bad publicity.

However, unless you are dead broke I think Sagittarius combos better with both Marcus Batty and Wormhole. Rather than simply trashing a program for free, as a baseline you pay three credits for "trash a program, plus match a trace five or lose a second one".

Additional thought: if Anarchs are giving you gip, and you go the Blacklist route, forgoing Crisium Grid as an "anti-nasty run effects" for you centrals, how does Swordsman sound? Cheap influence; cheap rez; kills AI-powered central shenanigans if Mimic isn't installed, taxes if Mimic is installed as a backup, or takes Parasites destined for your NEXT Silver; fits with the program-destruction plan.
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby Sixtyten » Sat Jul 11, 2015 12:09 pm

MOON MONEY!
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Re: NEXT Glacier

Postby Popeye09 » Sat Jul 11, 2015 9:40 pm

I think it's as good: both Swordsman and Wraparound are essentially a one credit tax, but Swordsman becomes a two-credit tax if you want to play with an AI.

It depends how much you value the "End the run" before the gear check is fulfilled I suppose (versus AI trash/damage), but it's not as if the NEXT ICE suite suffers for lack of "End the run" anyway. Wraparound is less likely to draw parasites too (either it's grinding to parasite it with no fracter, or you have a fracter so don't need to!).

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